Pages: 1 2 3  Next -- Posted by Event Horizon at 7:01 pm on July 5, 2009 I was just thinking: I really dislike the fact that atheism is becoming a youthful trend. I am happy that the idea is being broadcasted, and that some people are actually questioning their beliefs, but I fear that making atheism a "cool" youthful rebellion is undermining it. I do not want to see a world in which the people are atheists because it is the norm--as many people are religious because that is what everyone else is. I don't want an atheistic population of sheeple. So many kids are just saying "Yea, god is silly, I'm an atheist!" and I think that it undermines what being an atheist really is. It is not disdain for theism, no. It is, rather, individual thought and making decisions for one's self. I am happier with a theist who holds that position after deep forethought than an atheist who just thinks religion is silly. and I think that the popularization of atheism is leading down the road of the latter. Eh. Maybe not. Whatever. /rant. -- Posted by Descartes at 7:02 pm on July 5, 2009 I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/ -- Posted by LiveForeverDieTonite at 7:03 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:02 pm on July 5, 2009 I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/ -- Posted by Cunning Stunt at 7:03 pm on July 5, 2009 I know there is no god. Other than that, I just really hate organized religion. Except Buddhists. They're ok. -- Posted by Aimforthehead at 7:04 pm on July 5, 2009 I think we need to get to a point where it is so personal that people just don't care and no one is divided by it, or where religion is accepted world wide as unnecessary. -- Posted by Event Horizon at 7:04 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:02 pm on July 5, 2009 I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/ lean as you will. Neither is a better position. -- Posted by Descartes at 7:07 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:04 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:02 pm on July 5, 2009 I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/   lean as you will. Neither is a better position. The only piece of literature that keeps me from being an atheist is Thomas Aquinas's "The Five Ways" -- Posted by Aimforthehead at 7:07 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:03 pm on July 5, 2009 I know there is no god. Other than that, I just really hate organized religion. Except Buddhists. They're ok. You KNOW that? The only people who use language like that are religious people, that's a prime example of atheism turned into a religion. -- Posted by Cunning Stunt at 7:09 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Aimforthehead at 10:07 pm on July 5, 2009 You KNOW that?   The only people who use language like that are religious people, that's a prime example of atheism turned into a religion. There are atheist religions, you know. -- Posted by Shush at 7:09 pm on July 5, 2009 The unwashed masses are not capable of critical thought. You can't expect more than to herd them in the right direction, which is, of course, atheism. I'm glad it's the new theism. -- Posted by Aimforthehead at 7:11 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:09 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Aimforthehead at 10:07 pm on July 5, 2009 You KNOW that?  The only people who use language like that are religious people, that's a prime example of atheism turned into a religion. There are atheist religions, you know. Yep, then there is 'ATHEISM' the religion. Which is different from atheism as itself. It's a bit of irony lol. -- Posted by Cunning Stunt at 7:13 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:07 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:04 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:02 pm on July 5, 2009 I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/ lean as you will. Neither is a better position. The only piece of literature that keeps me from being an atheist is Thomas Aquinas's "The Five Ways" Ever read any Dawkins? Shit's intense. -- Posted by Event Horizon at 7:14 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Shush at 10:09 pm on July 5, 2009 The unwashed masses are not capable of critical thought. You can't expect more than to herd them in the right direction, which is, of course, atheism. I'm glad it's the new theism. You are the perfect example of what I'm against. If a person comes to the conclusion that there is a god, then GREAT! I am in no position to deny the existence of a god. I may disagree with the stories, but I know fuck-all about the universe. -- Posted by Descartes at 7:18 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:13 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:07 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:04 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:02 pm on July 5, 2009 I am agnostic...stating to lean towards atheism though :/ lean as you will. Neither is a better position. The only piece of literature that keeps me from being an atheist is Thomas Aquinas's "The Five Ways"   Ever read any Dawkins? Shit's intense. A good friend of mine has "The Selfish Gene". I've been meaning to borrow it it from him. -- Posted by Shush at 7:24 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:14 pm on July 5, 2009 If a person comes to the conclusion that there is a god, then GREAT! I'm not one to celebrate irrational and constrictive conclusions. Do you think every sort of baseless "gut feeling" is worth respecting, or just theism? Edit: By the way, I never suggested that anyone was in the "position to deny the existence of a god." -- Posted by Cunning Stunt at 7:30 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:18 pm on July 5, 2009 A good friend of mine has "The Selfish Gene". I've been meaning to borrow it it from him. Yeah I've got that. And also The God Delusion. -- Posted by Effigy at 7:35 pm on July 5, 2009 Is it just me or in all your post do you come across as ever so slightly elitist? It might be because you're reminding of a girl i used to go to school with. Anyway I don't think we can reasonably expect every atheist, or even the majority of atheists, to know the ins and outs of why religion and theism doesn't hold up. Perhaps rewording your post might drive the point home a bit better; let's imagine this post was written in the mid to late 1600's, how might it read? Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:01 pm on July 5, 2009 I was just thinking: I really dislike the fact that heliocentricism is becoming a youthful trend. I am happy that the idea is being broadcasted, and that some people are actually questioning their beliefs, but I fear that making heliocentricism a "cool" youthful rebellion is undermining it.   I do not want to see a world in which the people are heliocentricists because it is the norm--as many people are geocentricists because that is what everyone else is. I don't want an heliocentricist population of sheeple. So many kids are just saying "Yea, geocentricism is silly, I'm a heliocentricist!" and I think that it undermines what being an heliocentricist really is.   It is not disdain for geocentricism, no. It is, rather, individual thought and making decisions for one's self. I am happier with a geocentricist who holds that position after deep forethought than a heliocentricist who just thinks geocentricism is silly. and I think that the popularization of heliocentricism is leading down the road of the latter.   Eh. Maybe not. Whatever.   /rant. What we have today then is a population of heliocentricist 'sheeple'. If you asked most people on the street how they knew the earth goes around the sun they probably couldn't give you a straight answer; but isn't this better than a bunch of people who, after some 'deep forethought', hold to the position that it's actually the sun that orbits the earth? -- Posted by Descartes at 7:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:30 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:18 pm on July 5, 2009 A good friend of mine has "The Selfish Gene". I've been meaning to borrow it it from him. Yeah I've got that. And also The God Delusion. Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha. -- Posted by Event Horizon at 7:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Shush at 10:24 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 7:14 pm on July 5, 2009 If a person comes to the conclusion that there is a god, then GREAT! I'm not one to celebrate irrational and constrictive conclusions. Do you think every sort of baseless "gut feeling" is worth respecting, or just theism? Edit: By the way, I never suggested that anyone was in the "position to deny the existence of a god." There is not much that we can truly believe without a certain degree of "gut feeling". Apart from that, YES, I do believe that anything decided personally and after rational and individual thought is good. there is nothing inherently good about denying the existence of god. As long as the individual is of the impression that it is not good to force one's position on another, then I am fine. I respect very much the phenomenon of "gut feeling". It has served me well several times. -- Posted by Cunning Stunt at 7:39 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha. There's a part in The God Delusion where he pretty much says that agnostics are people who are too afraid to take a firm stance either way. -- Posted by Descartes at 7:42 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:39 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha. There's a part in The God Delusion where he pretty much says that agnostics are people who are too afraid to take a firm stance either way. Unfortunately that is pretty dead on. It's not necessarily that I'm afraid of making the choice. It's that i'm afraid that I wont be able to argue my choice or my beliefs if I were to fall on either side at the moment. -- Posted by exceedinglyrare at 7:43 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 10:01 pm on July 5, 2009 I was just thinking: I really dislike the fact that atheism is becoming a youthful trend. I am happy that the idea is being broadcasted, and that some people are actually questioning their beliefs, but I fear that making atheism a "cool" youthful rebellion is undermining it.   I do not want to see a world in which the people are atheists because it is the norm--as many people are religious because that is what everyone else is. I don't want an atheistic population of sheeple. So many kids are just saying "Yea, god is silly, I'm an atheist!" and I think that it undermines what being an atheist really is.   It is not disdain for theism, no. It is, rather, individual thought and making decisions for one's self. I am happier with a theist who holds that position after deep forethought than an atheist who just thinks religion is silly. and I think that the popularization of atheism is leading down the road of the latter.   Eh. Maybe not. Whatever.   /rant. I so appreciate this and agree on so many levels. It's part of the reason I wish that Christianity wasn't such a huge part of American culture so that you wouldn't get these people who call themselves Christian but have no idea what it means and are just doing it because everyone else is. And I'd say the same of Wicca and Satanism and Buddhism and even Jediism. If you came by your religious beliefs as a result of deep thought and searching, awesome, go you. If you came by your religious beliefs by either (a) rebelling or (b) doing what your friends/family do, I want to kick you. -- Posted by Cunning Stunt at 7:46 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 10:43 pm on July 5, 2009 I so appreciate this and agree on so many levels. It's part of the reason I wish that Christianity wasn't such a huge part of American culture so that you wouldn't get these people who call themselves Christian but have no idea what it means and are just doing it because everyone else is. And I'd say the same of Wicca and Satanism and Buddhism and even Jediism. If you came by your religious beliefs as a result of deep thought and searching, awesome, go you. If you came by your religious beliefs by either (a) rebelling or (b) doing what your friends/family do, I want to kick you. People think they're Jedi? Anyway, me = deep thoughts. I've never done anything for the sake of acceptance -- Posted by Effigy at 7:47 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 7:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:30 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:18 pm on July 5, 2009 A good friend of mine has "The Selfish Gene". I've been meaning to borrow it it from him.    Yeah I've got that. And also The God Delusion. Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha. If you're going to read some Dawkins books have a look at 'The Blind Watchmaker' It's my favourite of the Dawkins books I've read to date (The others being The God Delusion and The Ancestors Tale), he also has a new book coming out in september about the evidence for evolution. -- Posted by Descartes at 7:50 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Effigy at 7:47 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 7:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:30 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:18 pm on July 5, 2009 A good friend of mine has "The Selfish Gene". I've been meaning to borrow it it from him.   Yeah I've got that. And also The God Delusion.    Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha. If you're going to read some Dawkins books have a look at 'The Blind Watchmaker' It's my favourite of the Dawkins books I've read to date (The others being The God Delusion and The Ancestors Tale), he also has a new book coming out in september about the evidence for evolution. Will do :) I'll add it to my "to read" list lol. Thanks for the suggestion :) -- Posted by Effigy at 7:50 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:46 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 10:43 pm on July 5, 2009 I so appreciate this and agree on so many levels. It's part of the reason I wish that Christianity wasn't such a huge part of American culture so that you wouldn't get these people who call themselves Christian but have no idea what it means and are just doing it because everyone else is. And I'd say the same of Wicca and Satanism and Buddhism and even Jediism. If you came by your religious beliefs as a result of deep thought and searching, awesome, go you. If you came by your religious beliefs by either (a) rebelling or (b) doing what your friends/family do, I want to kick you.   People think they're Jedi?   Anyway, me = deep thoughts. I've never done anything for the sake of acceptance According to the 2001 census, New Zealand had more Jedi's (1.5%) than Muslims, Hindus or Buddists. . -- Posted by Event Horizon at 8:19 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 10:39 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha. There's a part in The God Delusion where he pretty much says that agnostics are people who are too afraid to take a firm stance either way. He also chastises people who make decisions without absolute evidence, and yet does just that. As humans we, in fact, have NO IDEA WHAT IS GOING ON in the universe. While it may be the case that the idea of God is not the most logical, showing the inconsistencies in religious ideologies hardly proves that no god exists, and, even if that is the case, standing on a soap box and preaching that no god exists is just as immature as preaching that god does. I can't see how one could find a more logical stance than "we don't know what the fuck is up" -- Posted by Event Horizon at 8:23 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from exceedinglyrare at 10:43 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 10:01 pm on July 5, 2009 I was just thinking:    I really dislike the fact that atheism is becoming a youthful trend. I am happy that the idea is being broadcasted, and that some people are actually questioning their beliefs, but I fear that making atheism a "cool" youthful rebellion is undermining it.  I do not want to see a world in which the people are atheists because it is the norm--as many people are religious because that is what everyone else is. I don't want an atheistic population of sheeple. So many kids are just saying "Yea, god is silly, I'm an atheist!" and I think that it undermines what being an atheist really is.  It is not disdain for theism, no. It is, rather, individual thought and making decisions for one's self. I am happier with a theist who holds that position after deep forethought than an atheist who just thinks religion is silly. and I think that the popularization of atheism is leading down the road of the latter.  Eh. Maybe not. Whatever.  /rant. I so appreciate this and agree on so many levels. It's part of the reason I wish that Christianity wasn't such a huge part of American culture so that you wouldn't get these people who call themselves Christian but have no idea what it means and are just doing it because everyone else is. And I'd say the same of Wicca and Satanism and Buddhism and even Jediism. If you came by your religious beliefs as a result of deep thought and searching, awesome, go you. If you came by your religious beliefs by either (a) rebelling or (b) doing what your friends/family do, I want to kick you. Exactly. If I were to support anything, it would not be a theological position, it would be a "think for your fucking self" position. I think that anyone who is interested in the betterment of the human population should hold the same ideology as well; to support any one position is to further the problem of people being sheep. If we are too evolve into a better people, we must move past being sheep. -- Posted by Effigy at 8:24 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Event Horizon at 8:19 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 10:39 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Descartes at 10:38 pm on July 5, 2009 Hmm, I'll have to give it a look. Maybe it will be the thing to push me over the line haha.    There's a part in The God Delusion where he pretty much says that agnostics are people who are too afraid to take a firm stance either way. He also chastises people who make decisions without absolute evidence, and yet does just that. As humans we, in fact, have NO IDEA WHAT IS GOING ON in the universe. While it may be the case that the idea of God is not the most logical, showing the inconsistencies in religious ideologies hardly proves that no god exists, and, even if that is the case, standing on a soap box and preaching that no god exists is just as immature as preaching that god does.   I can't see how one could find a more logical stance than "we don't know what the fuck is up" Where does he do that? Chapter and Verse please. Also we actually have a pretty good picture of what is going on in the universe, not perfect by any means but we aren't totally clueless. -- Posted by static nightmare at 8:32 pm on July 5, 2009 Quote: from Aimforthehead at 12:07 pm on July 6, 2009 Quote: from Cunning Stunt at 7:03 pm on July 5, 2009 I know there is no god. Other than that, I just really hate organized religion. Except Buddhists. They're ok. You KNOW that?   The only people who use language like that are religious people, that's a prime example of atheism turned into a religion. How do you know this? Pages: 1 2 3  Next