-- Posted by mike11455 at 12:15 am on July 3, 2009 I'm 19 years old, and looking to get a new car <$27.5k. I'm down to either a NEW subbie WRX(sedan), used E46 BMW M3, or used LS2 Pontiac GTO. Gas mileages(16-18 city, 21-25 hw), insurance (~1200/6 mos), 0-60, and 1/4 are all comparable...so it comes to intangibles. Everyone tells me to get the Subaru for practicality's sake (college), but the beemer looks SO damn sexy, and the GTO is a straight up beast and in limited production. Please don't bitch about how obvious the decision may seem to you, or why a 19 year old doesn't need a car like this - just give me your opinion with reasons why. -- Posted by emo sux69 at 12:17 am on July 3, 2009 GTO, it has Balls. -- Posted by revived5656 at 12:18 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from emo sux69 at 3:17 am on July 3, 2009 GTO, it has Balls. BALLS TO THE WALL SON! -- Posted by drifting at 12:23 am on July 3, 2009 GTO. -- Posted by mike11455 at 12:24 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from emo sux69 at 12:17 am on July 3, 2009 GTO, it has Balls. course you'd say that, they're produced in australia! haha   -- Posted by anthonykorsen007 at 12:33 am on July 3, 2009 I'm a bit of a GTO fan. First I should say that the whole 0-60 and quarter mile times are not only very difficult to relate to normal driving. And it's entirely dependent on the driver. Either way, I go with V8. A friend of mine once said that when Americans want to add power, they add cylinders / displacement. When most foreign companies (Japan mainly) want more, they add turbochargers or tweak the computer--something that modifies it a whole lot of physical hardware. All of this adds power, yes, but only additional pistons and connecting rods will ever add torque. Hence, I say V8. And the GTO just sounds so beautiful. -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 12:39 am on July 3, 2009 I've personally driven several WRX's, and several GTO's , both auto and manual, both ls1 and ls2. Personally, the LS1 is a better deal. bigger aftermarket, cheaper insurance, better fuel economy, even if modded, etc. -- Posted by mike11455 at 12:47 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 12:39 am on July 3, 2009 I've personally driven several WRX's, and several GTO's , both auto and manual, both ls1 and ls2.   Personally, the LS1 is a better deal. bigger aftermarket, cheaper insurance, better fuel economy, even if modded, etc.   i like the changes they made to the 6.0s...i'm not a fan of the 5.7s. i like the (fake) hoodscoops and dual exhaust. plus, IF i decide to go with a GTO, i'll have to find one that hasn't been thrashed into the ground, and i think i have a better chance of that with the later model year. didn't like the WRX? i test drove and fell in love with it. plus, i'm not sold on 6-speeds....yet -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 12:51 am on July 3, 2009 FYI - The LS1 has dual exhaust. The hoods can be found cheaper than you'd imagine, and for what it's worth, the LS2 will be more likely to have been beaten on due to more POWAR. pic related.. -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 12:53 am on July 3, 2009 The WRX was nice but the fact that the transmissions can be likened to a piece of glass scares the shit out of me. The only thing you need to worry about with a GTO is really wheelhop which happens when you're cuttin the ass end loose.. can be countered with one side's halfshaft being a little thicker. Aftermarket companies offer these thicker CV's. -- Posted by mike11455 at 12:58 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 12:53 am on July 3, 2009 The WRX was nice but the fact that the transmissions can be likened to a piece of glass scares the shit out of me.   The only thing you need to worry about with a GTO is really wheelhop which happens when you're cuttin the ass end loose.. can be countered with one side's halfshaft being a little thicker. Aftermarket companies offer these thicker CV's. course a V8's got dual exhaust, but i visually like the split ends on each side. i think the 6.0s have a gto-marked diffuser too. i haven't heard of any problems with the subbie trannys...? i've hear of knocking issues though. -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 1:02 am on July 3, 2009 It's a pretty well-known fact that the subaru transmissions are weak. from experience with friends, the LS1 is cheaper to insure as well.. a bumper / cat back system from an 05/06 would save you money. Then again, I'm an LS1 nutswinger. -- Posted by mike11455 at 1:04 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 1:02 am on July 3, 2009 It's a pretty well-known fact that the subaru transmissions are weak.   from experience with friends, the LS1 is cheaper to insure as well.. a bumper / cat back system from an 05/06 would save you money. Then again, I'm an LS1 nutswinger. haha it's all good. are parts easy enough to find? pontiac's dead, and they only made a few goats. -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 1:09 am on July 3, 2009 They're a lot more plentiful than one would expect. .have you driven any of the cars? If not, get out there.. you're in Cali so there's a lot of them out there. Drive Automatic and Manual of both LS1/LS2. I liked the LS2 Manual most because of it having so much more power, but the LS1 is easier to work with / bigger gains to be had. -- Posted by mike11455 at 1:14 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 1:09 am on July 3, 2009 They're a lot more plentiful than one would expect. .have you driven any of the cars? If not, get out there.. you're in Cali so there's a lot of them out there. Drive Automatic and Manual of both LS1/LS2. I liked the LS2 Manual most because of it having so much more power, but the LS1 is easier to work with / bigger gains to be had. i've tested an '09 WRX, 2 E46 M3s both coupe and convertible, all manuals only. the closest thing to the GTO i've driven is a stick G8 GXP but it was a promo and i never really got to "drive" it haha. i'm not interested in an automatic. -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 1:19 am on July 3, 2009 From personal experience, the new Cobalt SS Turbocharged is just as fast as the LS1/2 GTO's, and can be had new for low twenties. Have you looked at those? 5spd / LSD / etc. 260hp, 260tq. It did the Nurburgring in 8:22. for what it's worth, the new Camaro SS did the 'Ring in 8:20. It's a VERY fast car. -- Posted by i r sekz at 1:20 am on July 3, 2009 WRX or M3.  I'd personally choose the M3. -- Posted by mike11455 at 1:24 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 1:19 am on July 3, 2009 From personal experience, the new Cobalt SS Turbocharged is just as fast as the LS1/2 GTO's, and can be had new for low twenties. Have you looked at those? 5spd / LSD / etc. 260hp, 260tq.   It did the Nurburgring in 8:22. for what it's worth, the new Camaro SS did the 'Ring in 8:20. It's a VERY fast car.   ugh, i know they put out massive stats, and i hear they are an awesome drive, but it is just a douchebag car. no offense. it's only a step above neon srt-4... -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 1:25 am on July 3, 2009 Not at all. Everyone I know who has one (friends or people on boards like CobaltSS.Net) is actually not a douchebag. -- Posted by i r sekz at 1:27 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 4:25 am on July 3, 2009 Not at all. Everyone I know who has one (friends or people on boards like CobaltSS.Net) is actually not a douchebag. Yeah but you are a douche bag, sooo, can anyone still trust your opinion... -- Posted by 3800 FTW at 1:30 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from i r sekz at 1:27 am on July 3, 2009 Yeah but you are a douche bag, sooo, can anyone still trust your opinion... what makes you think that? Honest question. You don't know me apart from what I've said to you on this forum, so your opinion really holds no water when it comes down to it, but I'm curious to know why you think that way. -- Posted by mike11455 at 1:35 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 1:25 am on July 3, 2009 Not at all. Everyone I know who has one (friends or people on boards like CobaltSS.Net) is actually not a douchebag. but down where i live in socal, the ONLY people that cobalt's are white-power bros that are only interested in flooring out of every possible stop light and acting hard. -- Posted by i r sekz at 1:36 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from 3800 FTW at 4:30 am on July 3, 2009 Quote: from i r sekz at 1:27 am on July 3, 2009 Yeah but you are a douche bag, sooo, can anyone still trust your opinion... what makes you think that?   Honest question. You don't know me apart from what I've said to you on this forum, so your opinion really holds no water when it comes down to it, but I'm curious to know why you think that way. Because you respond like me, thus making you a douche bag since I am one also.   -- Posted by emo sux69 at 2:32 am on July 3, 2009 Eric refer to my pic. cobalts suck becuase of it. -- Posted by Cabrio at 2:16 pm on July 3, 2009 That's a tough choice. I love all three, but if it were my money I'd be looking at the nicest E46 M3 I could find, and save up for the VFE supercharger, E92 M3 power for under 30k... they are track ready stock, have a dyno graph that I would kill for (high RPM power and lots of mid-range torque,) they look amazing, the seats are pretty damn good, love the way the exhaust sounds, pretty good 6sp gear box, etc. etc. But Eric brings up an awesome point, brand new Cobalt SS 2.0T cars are downright cheap, and quick. A friend has one, with just a tune and weight reduction its running a 13.1 quarter mile time, and its just going to get faster. With either 3, you're getting a high performance, high value car. When you say intangibles though, you shouldn't be asking a forum for advice. Intangibles can only be felt by individuals. What I like is different from you, so my advice think to yourself: which of these 3 cars makes me smile the most when I drive it? If you're 100% sure you can afford it, it all boils down to which car makes you happiest, it is after all your car. -- Posted by ss454 at 3:34 pm on July 3, 2009 GTO Cobalt SS is pretty hot, though. -- Posted by Neodymie at 12:41 am on July 4, 2009 I'd personally go with the GTO. They're just the sexiest IMO.