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  LiveWire / Teen Forums / Race, Ethnicity & Nationality / Viewing Topic

Racial Rights
Replies: 117Last Post Sep. 22, 2008 2:52pm by kidd rune
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( kidd rune )


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Actually from the mummy of ramses II he looks black not white.
Are you looking at a different picture than the Anthropologists?


I'm not confident that's true. Of course, it'd take a shitload of peer review or my administering the tests myself to convince me fully. Given that, we'll just let that point stew on its own for a while.
Dr. G.W. Ferfuson tested and proved it.


Yet another issue that is too complex to make such definitive statements about. We can't know what would happen if physiological "Negroes" were dropped into an uninhabited Europe. How would the distinct environment affect their development, culturally, technologically? Similarly, if biologically white populations were dropped into sub-Saharan Africa with a blank-slate culturally/technologically, what would we see them build? Great statues? Vast empires? Or would they live as we know "negro" Africans live(ed)?
The Nubians inhabiting Egypt created NOTHING. When the whites migrated there, they created one of the greatest civilizations that ever existed.


Do you believe we can answer those questions? It's clear that we can't. You can't attribute the development of distinct cultures to any one factor. You can't put so much of it on race, as one factor, because it is simply too complex.
Regardless, their countries are still quite shitty.


Fortunately, no, they aren't. Are you a conspiracy theorist too? I'm not asking for a website skewing single-party research to fit an end. I'd like information from mainstream scientific organizations. Not obscure websites pushing their agendas, whether Afro-centric or "Nords-are-responsible-for-all-great-things-and-all-great-people-were-at-least-part-Nord" agendas.
Then YOU find a website. I've seen many that people on this forum have linked to, claiming inventions for other civilizations or races, and are EASILY debunked.



The claim that Ancient Egyptians were Semites is not an Afro-centric claim, as Semites are not an exclusively (or indeed, even primarily) African people. Semites are a Caucasian people.
Still, too much evidence rides on the fact that it was, indeed, whites that created it. They used the Semitic people as slaves along with the Negroes.


Classic. In scientific terms, the truth can't be buried that way. A controversial group's claims can be verified by independent research. That's how science progresses. Nobody takes your word for it. You show your methods, they imitate and compare their results. If there was discernible evidence for a white origin of Ancient Egyptian culture it couldn't be squashed by simple claims of "racism."
There IS so much evidence, it's just 'racist' to claim otherwise.



Egyptian Semites would be a Mediterranean people. What Nordic traits, and how are these traits specific to Nordic groups?
No. Semitic people are SEMITES, not Mediterraneans. Anyway, Mediterraneans are WHITE.
Whites are:
Mediterraneans
Nordics
Alpines
Dinarics
Baltics

And nordic traits include their hair, face, bones, ect...


I did read that, and again, the scientific research doesn't back that claim. There are some white haplotypes among North Egyptian groups. Nothing about that speaks to race mixing, the fall of Egypt or anything else. Given that only your White History website is making that claim (you'll note it's not in the Article and White History acknowledges that), why should I accept it as legit?
Only my white history site? Hardly.


You think that picture is detailed enough to make a claim at the race of those pictured? Nothing about that image suggests that Ramses was not himself a Semite.
Ramses II was, in no way, Semitic. He had red hair and he has a Nordish facial structure.

http://white-history.com/earlson/rameses.htm


Everything found there refutes the claim that the Egyptians were black "negroes." That isn't my claim. The Egyptians were (primarily) Semites, a Caucasian and not a Negroid people. Again your source speaks of "White Egyptians, White Pharaoh __ __," without bringing forward evidence to support the claim. We are expected to accept on face value the claim that they were white, and listen to their (reasonable) arguments as to why the Egyptians weren't a primarily negroid people. The second part is not at issue; Semites =/= black and blacks =/= Semites. The first, accepting the claim of White Egyptians at face value is a problem.
You're the only person I've met that claims the Semites made Egypt. In reality, it's a black-white debate. Seeing as nobody really claims that Semites created Egypt but you, there wouldn't be many arguments against it.

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woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

8:45 am on Sep. 6, 2008 | Joined: Nov. 2007 | Days Active: 269
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Quote: from kidd rune at 8:45 am on Sep. 6, 2008

Dr. G.W. Ferfuson tested and proved it.

You mean this entire time you've been waving around the results of one study, by one individual? You are familiar with the concept of peer review yes? You understand that nothing is "proven" by one individual?


The Nubians inhabiting Egypt created NOTHING. When the whites migrated there, they created one of the greatest civilizations that ever existed.

Again all of this with no proof and no backing by mainstream science. Whether or not Nubians were successful or not is irrelevant. You can't blame that on their race, because there are too many side factors. Any and all of it may be up to chance, and we have no method to determine the issue one way or another.  

The Egyptians were a Semitic, or at least, Afro-asiatic people.


Regardless, their countries are still quite shitty.

Irrelevant.


Then YOU find a website. I've seen many that people on this forum have linked to, claiming inventions for other civilizations or races, and are EASILY debunked.

I don't want websites, I want assertions made by mainstream scientific organizations, who are transparent in their methodology, whose efforts undergo peer review, and who are largely respected as sources for information. Not websites, and certainly not the sort you're giving us.  


Still, too much evidence rides on the fact that it was, indeed, whites that created it. They used the Semitic people as slaves along with the Negroes.

Your only source for that evidence so far has been a racist, white-favoring website, and the researchers who accrued the evidence were NOT making the claim your website was.


There IS so much evidence, it's just 'racist' to claim otherwise.

I don't see you offering counterpoints. If it could be proven scientifically that the Egyptians were a white group, it would be done. That no mainstream organizations are asserting that is evidence of the lack of evidence, not of some Afrocentric bias. Without the added claims that Nordic peoples are responsible for all historical greatness to add perspective, the simple claim that Ancient Egyptians were white would not carry racist or white-supremacist connotations in the majority of minds.



No. Semitic people are SEMITES, not Mediterraneans.

You understand that any people inhabiting Mediterranean areas would be refered to as Mediterranean, correct? Egyptian semites on the coast of the Mediterranean would be a Semitic, Mediterranean people.


And nordic traits include their hair, face, bones, ect...

Traits such as?


Only my white history site? Hardly.

Who else?  


Ramses II was, in no way, Semitic. He had red hair and he has a Nordish facial structure.
 

Red hair? Really? According to whom? Please describe to me a Nordic facial structure.


You're the only person I've met that claims the Semites made Egypt. In reality, it's a black-white debate. Seeing as nobody really claims that Semites created Egypt but you, there wouldn't be many arguments against it.

I've never known it to be up for debate. If not a specifically Semitic (I don't know the exact borders of that group; I understand Arabs, Hebrews and other smaller groups to make up the present majority) then a related Afroasiatic group. It's really splitting hairs in the end.

If the Egyptians were a white people why did they not speak a White language? Their language was/is Afroasiatic, and not an Indo-European as every White group (white by your definition) speaks.

Post edited at 9:26 pm on Sep. 6, 2008 by Shaknbake


9:24 pm on Sep. 6, 2008 | Joined: Mar. 2006 | Days Active: 607
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( kidd rune )


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You mean this entire time you've been waving around the results of one study, by one individual? You are familiar with the concept of peer review yes? You understand that nothing is "proven" by one individual?
He preformed the study, many accepted it.


Again all of this with no proof and no backing by mainstream science. Whether or not Nubians were successful or not is irrelevant. You can't blame that on their race, because there are too many side factors. Any and all of it may be up to chance, and we have no method to determine the issue one way or another.  

The Egyptians were a Semitic, or at least, Afro-asiatic people.


Again all of this with no proof and no backing by mainstream science. See, I can do it too!


Irrelevant.
No, it isn't. And again, an example of Negroes taking over a white country and turning it into a shit-hole is happening at this very second. Check here. South Africa was created by whites and whites ruled it. Now, it's different, and South Africa is falling. It's so simple, all other "side factors" are so random that anyone with a bit of common sense can tell what's happening and why.



I don't want websites, I want assertions made by mainstream scientific organizations, who are transparent in their methodology, whose efforts undergo peer review, and who are largely respected as sources for information. Not websites, and certainly not the sort you're giving us.
I tried sticking a book into my computer, but the CD drive is too small =(



Your only source for that evidence so far has been a racist, white-favoring website, and the researchers who accrued the evidence were NOT making the claim your website was.
The site isn't racist, it's just focusing on the history of one race. I want to see proof that the creators of Egypt were, indeed, Semitic.


I don't see you offering counterpoints. If it could be proven scientifically that the Egyptians were a white group, it would be done. That no mainstream organizations are asserting that is evidence of the lack of evidence, not of some Afrocentric bias. Without the added claims that Nordic peoples are responsible for all historical greatness to add perspective, the simple claim that Ancient Egyptians were white would not carry racist or white-supremacist connotations in the majority of minds.
Yes, yes it would. So many Negroes believe that the Egyptians were black. The absurd notion that Ancient Egypt was a product of Negro ingenuity is now being widely disseminated in the schools. Scholars know this is a blatant lie, they justify the deception by assuming it will boost the "self-esteem" of Black children. The same can be said about the Semitic people. There is so much white guilt going on, they want some other races to feel good about themselves.



Red hair? Really? According to whom? Please describe to me a Nordic facial structure.

http://www.white-history.com/earlson/rameses.htm
Your favorite site!

Check:
Brier, Bob (1998). The Encyclopedia of Mummies. Checkmark Books.
It claims that "Microscopic inspection of the roots of Ramesses II's hair revealed that the king was a redhead."

You can do a nice Google search to confirm that too. Ramses II had red hair. It is easily distinguishable by his mummy and they inspected it and PROVED it.

And, as you know, red hair is a PURELY Nordish trait.

The Nordic racial sub grouping, which is still largely in existence to day, is characterized by light colored hair and eyes, a tall slim body build and a distinctive "long" (that is, thin and extended) skull shape.



I've never known it to be up for debate. If not a specifically Semitic (I don't know the exact borders of that group; I understand Arabs, Hebrews and other smaller groups to make up the present majority) then a related Afroasiatic group. It's really splitting hairs in the end.

If the Egyptians were a white people why did they not speak a White language? Their language was/is Afroasiatic, and not an Indo-European as every White group (white by your definition) speaks.


Not every white group speaks Indo-European Languages.
Egyptian itself is the one of the oldest recorded languages known. It was created from scratch, with no other language to base off of. There was no definite nonwhite influence on their language.

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

8:42 am on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Nov. 2007 | Days Active: 269
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Quote: from drkberry at 8:26 pm on Sep. 1, 2008

Anything this troll says i just have to disagree with, I can't tolerate him anymore.

same here!

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9:00 am on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Mar. 2008 | Days Active: 159
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Quote: from babygurl 2008 at 9:00 am on Sep. 7, 2008

Quote: from drkberry at 8:26 pm on Sep. 1, 2008

Anything this troll says i just have to disagree with, I can't tolerate him anymore.

same here!


I agreed with you before, are you changing your views because of this?

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

10:50 am on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Nov. 2007 | Days Active: 269
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Quote: from kidd rune at 8:42 am on Sep. 7, 2008

He preformed the study, many accepted it.
that proves shit. Anybody can make some study, twist the results and get "many" to agree with him. Science requires a LOT of DIFFERENT studies from DIFFERENT scientist to be worth anything.

And science is not like a religon you can just see and believe blindly.


Again all of this with no proof and no backing by mainstream science. See, I can do it too!
Thats why race is basically something you can't prove and define 100%.


No, it isn't.
yes it is. (look out the failtroll is going to say "no it is isn't" then I can say again "yes it is". Thats pretty funny stuff.


And again, an example of Negroes taking over a white country and turning it into a shit-hole is happening at this very second.
Nubia was not a shit-hole

 http://wysinger.homestead.com/chronology.html


3800-2950 BCE: Nubian A-group civilization, parallel to the Naqada 2 and 3 pre-dynastic cultures of Egypt. Qustul in Nubia could well have been the seat of Egypt's founding dynasty. Located in today's southern Egypt and northern Sudan was most probably the oldest cultural complex in Africa. Known as Nubia, "The Land of Gold," to Egypt, the people of this land first called their civilization Ta-Seti, "Land of the Bow." Named so for its famous archers, Ta-Seti was a land of natural wealth, of gold mines, ebony, ivory and incense which she traded heavily with her neighbors.


Kerma first capital of Nubia. Nubia is the homeland of Africa's earliest black culture with a history which can be traced from 7000 B.C. onward through Nubian monuments temples, artifacts, as well as written records from Egypt, Italy and Rome.


The number of pyramids in ancient Nubia were a total of 223, double the pyramids of its neighbor Egypt.


Ancient Nubia (Sudan) (Map). Around 5,000 years ago, a rich and powerful nation called the kingdom of Kush (also referred to as ancient Nubia) was a center of culture and military might in Africa. Ancient Nubia had a wealth of natural resources such as gold, ivory, copper, frankincense and ebony but they also produced and traded a variety of goods such as pottery.  The Nubians formed the foundation of the Proto-Dravidians, Proto-Elamites, Proto-Mande speakers and West Atlantic people.

Elusive A Group findings.

Their bowmen warriors (Exhibit 1) were known and feared by those who saw them in battles. Ancient Nubia's lands are now part of modern Egypt and Sudan. Its geographic position meant that much of ancient Nubia's development is connected to that of ancient Egypt. In fact, Egypt ruled much of Nubia between 2000 B.C. and 1000 B.C., but when Egypt collapsed into civil war, Nubian kings ruled Egypt from around 800 B.C. to 700 B.C.

The Nubians are believed to be the first human race on earth, and most of their customs and traditions were adopted by the ancient Egyptians [Diodorus; History, Book III: 2).. To the Greeks, they were known as Ethiopians and Nubia as the land of Punts, i.e. the land of gods.

Nubians are the people of northern Sudan and southern Egypt. With a history and traditions which can be traced to the dawn of civilization, the Nubian first settled along the banks of the Nile from Aswan. Along this great river they developed one of the oldest and greatest civilizations in Africa. Until they lost their last kingdom (Christian Nubia) only five centuries back the Nubians remained as the main rivals to the other great African civilization of Egypt.

Nubia is the homeland of Africa's earliest black culture with a history which can be traced from 3800 B.C. onward through Nubian monuments and artifacts, as well as written records from Egypt and Rome. In antiquity, Nubia was a land of great natural wealth, of gold mines, ebony, ivory and incense which was always prized by her neighbors.


http://wysinger.homestead.com/nubians.html


Origin of Farming in Africa: Ancient Nubia
Kevin Shillington, History of Africa, St. Martin's Press, 1995, pp. 16-17

It has generally been accepted that the strains of barley and wheat cultivated in Ancient Egypt were first domesticated in Mesopotamia. But there is increasing archaeological evidence that certain strains of wild barley were being tended and possibly cultivated by the ancient peoples of Egypt and Nubia (south of the Nile's first cataract) by 10,000 B.C. and perhaps even as early as 16,000 B.C. Sorghum and millet, certainly of local African origin, were being harvested in the Khartoum region of the upper Nile by 6000 BC.

All these "farming" communities, however, seem to have been only partially dependent on farming. They still spent a considerable time hunting, gathering and sometimes fishing. In addition, the climate was then wetter than it is at present and a small annual rainfall would have provided some vegetation to the east and west of the Nile.

Egypt is a desert. The Nile River runs through the middle of it. Egypt gets virtually no rainfall and from east and west the desert encroaches almost to the banks of the Nile. The climate is generally warm and can reach 110 degrees Fahrenheit (43 degrees Celsius), but usually the nights are cool. Under these circumstances the peoples of the Nile valley learned to exploit more and more exclusively the unique characteristics of the Nile river itself.

Huss-Ashmore, Rebecca, Microperspectives (Food and Nutrition in History and Anthropology), Taylor & Francis, 1989, pp. 166-168:

Populations used in this study are primarily from the Nubian C-Group (2400-1000 B.C.), Meroitic (350 B.C. - A.D. 350),

X-Group or Ballana (A.D. 350-550), and Christian (A.D. 550-1300) periods. This material was excavated from sites in Lower Nubia (described as the portion of the Nile River Valley that extends from the First Cataract at Aswan, Egypt, to the Second Cataract at Wadi Halfa, Sudan). Prehistorically, the region represents a major line of communication between sub-Saharan Africa and the Mediterranean. The sample consists of both subadults and adults of varying ages and both sexes. Today the locals continues to eat a diet comprised of the same cereal grains prepared in much the same way as did their ancestors.

The C-Group (2400-1000 B.C.) in Lower Nubia represents a mixed subsistence pattern using gathered, hunted and agricultural products. The Meroitic, X-Group and Christian groups subsisted fully on agricultural products (Adams 1970). During the Meroitic period, the development of the saqia (waterwheel) in upper Nubia allowed the intensification of agriculture thus increasing the productive potential of the region, and permitting the support of a larger population. (Adams 1970). Farmers from this period to the present could now grow several crops a year, and were able to irrigate farther from the Nile (as well as the banks higher than those next to the river) (Trigger 1965). Crops grown on these lands required a much greater energy investment per acre than did single annual crops grown on the alluvial flood plains.

The archaeological record shows a strategy that involved three growing seasons. Crops harvested included millet, wheat, barley, beans, tobacco, lentils, peas and watermelon (Trigger 1965). Dates, mangoes, and citrus trees could also be kept watered during dry seasons to produce more fruit. Cattle, sheep and goats probably were herded; however cattle were used to run the waterwheel and were most likely not eaten (Adams 1970). Milk and butter may have been used in trade (Trigger 1965).

Cattle breeding played an important role in Kerma suggesting that grasslands were more extensive in the time of the Old Kingdom. In addition, the Nile Delta below Memphis has always been one of great fertility, flanked on its eastern and western borders by wide meadowlands where goats, sheep and cattle were raised. The fertility of Nubia and it's products enriched both Egyptian and Nubian cultures which lived along the Nile.

In the classic volume Growing Up In an Egyptian Village, Ammar (1966) documents the day-to-day life in modern peasant community living along the banks of the Nile. The village, Silwa, is approximately 350 km north of the archaeological site used in this study. The descriptive account confirms the archaeological reconstruction provided by Adam (1970) and Trigger (1965) for the prehistoric Sudanese Nubians. Intensive farming activities consume the largest portion of adult activity. Millet, wheat and barley form the basis of the subsistence base, and other crops are grown for cashing or trading. Some livestock such as cattle are kept as resources for milk and butter, which is also sometimes traded. Ammar convincingly suggests that Silwa largely represents traditional agriculturally based communities in the region, and his accounts lend credence to our interpretation of the prehistoric Sudanese Nubian lifeways.




. Egyptian-Nubian Relations 2200-1550 BC

Between the end of the Old Kingdom and the beginning of the Middle Kingdom (from ca. 2134-2040 BC), political turmoil in Egypt brought an end to trading expeditions like those of Harkhuf. At the same time, major political changes must also have taken place in Upper Nubia. The name "Yam" disappears in Egyptian texts and is replaced by the name "Kush," which the Egyptians regularly modified by an adjective meaning "vile" or "contemptible." The Yamites may have been friendly to Egypt; the Kushites, who replaced them, may have been much more menacing.

With the reunification of Egypt under the pharoahs of Dynasties 11 and 12 (ca. 2040-1783 BC), the Egyptians aggressively reoccupied Lower Nubia, penetrated to the head of the Second Cataract, and built a series of eleven impregnable fortresses along its desolate reaches. Each fort was defended by a massive mud brick wall system; this was surrounded by dry moats and walls with bastions and loopholes for archers. These structures served a number of purposes. One was to facilitate a massive trading operation with Upper Nubia by assisting and protecting shippers moving up or down the rapids, by providing safe havens and hostels for caravans travelling along the river, and by keeping potentially threatening peoples away. One of the most important purposes, however, must have been to display a strong defensive posture to the rulers of Kush to discourage them from attempting any sort of military moves to the north. These forts were all within signalling distance and were permanently garrisoned and well-supplied. They were given names that revealed their purpose: "Warding off the Bows," "Subduer of the Nubians (Nehesy)," "Curbing the Foreign Lands." At the southern limit of the Second Cataract, at a place called Semna, the Egyptians set up their official southern boundary marker.

About 1750 BC, Egypt again destabilized internally and withdrew from the Nile forts. In the north, a powerful people of Near Eastern origin moved in to occupy the Nile Delta; in Egyptian history they are known as the "Hyksos" (from Egyptian words which meant "Princes of Foreign Lands"), and they established two consecutive dynasties, the 15th and 16th. For a century they considered the Egyptian princes of Thebes their vassals. When the Theban ruler Kamose (ca. 1555-1550 BC) came to the throne of the south, the reigning Hyksos king conspired with the king of Kush to divide up Kamose's kingdom between them. This knowledge stirred the Thebans, first, to drive the Hyksos out of Egypt, which they did in a series of actions during the reign of Kamose's successor Ahmose I (ca. 1550-1525 BC), founder of Dynasty 18. Second, it encouraged them to invade Nubia and to destroy the kingdom of Kush, which had by then siezed all of the Nile Valley northwards to Aswan itself. The plan adopted by the new pharaohs was to invade Kush, annex its territory to Egypt, govern it directly, and sieze control of the Africa trade. This proved to be a much more complex task than expelling the Hyksos, for Kush was not completely subdued until the reign of Thutmose III (ca. 1479-1425 BC).

2. Kerma, the First Nubian City

Only one archaeological site in the Sudan fits all the criteria for having been the capital of the first kingdom of Kush. This is the site called Kerma, after the modern Sudanese village that occupies its site. Its ancient name remains unknown because no inscriptions have yet been found there that preserve it. The Nubians of this period still did not normally use writing, although some people, who did business with the Egyptians, may have learned hieroglyphic writing. Kerma lies just about 10 miles (16.5 km) south of the Third Cataract, on the east bank of the Nile, and about 170 miles (266 km) upstream from the nearest Egyptian fort. The first excavations were conducted by George A. Reisner and his team from Harvard University and the Museum of Fine Arts, Boston, between 1913 and 1915. Since 1973, excavations have been continued annually by Charles Bonnet and his team from the University of Geneva, Switzerland.

Kerma consisted of a central city, surrounded by a series of defensive walls and moats. This incorporated a palace and a religious sanctuary and about 200 houses. The palace itself evolved from a large round building, about 12 m (40 ft.) in diameter, to a rectangular structure over four times as large. Originally the houses were round, as in the "pre-Kerma" settlement; later, like the palace, they were rectangular, perhaps under Egytian influence. Outside the walls were other heavily populated areas, still poorly known, as well as an area of small temples apparently dedicated to the worship of deceased kings. Along the riverbank were dockyards and warehouses. An enormous cemetery lay about 2 mi (3 km) to the east.

The main feature of the town was a large solid brick platform which in its latest phase stood about 60 ft (18 m), high and measured about 170 x 85 ft (52 x 25.8 m). This building is known as the "Western Deffufa" (after an old Nubian word for a mud brick structure) in order to distinguish it from the "Eastern Deffufa," a similarly sized but lower brick building that rises in the cemetery. It is now known that these buildings were temples. The Western Deffufa was a huge brick platform on top of which there was probably a small shrine or object of worship. The "Eastern Deffufa" was associated with the worship or preparation for burial of the dead kings.


See? I can send out a deluge of source to support my claims too.  

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Quote: from kidd rune at 8:42 am on Sep. 7, 2008

And, as you know, red hair is a PURELY Nordish trait.


Red hair (also referred to as auburn, ginger, ranga or titian) varies from a deep orange-red through burnt orange to bright copper. It is characterized by high levels of the reddish pigment pheomelanin and relatively low levels of the dark pigment eumelanin. People with red hair are often referred to as redheads or, gingers.[1] Approximately 1% to 2% of the human population have red hair.[2][3] It occurs more frequently (between 2% and 6% of the population) in northern and western Europeans, and their descendants, and at lower frequencies throughout other parts of Europe, Asia and Africa.

http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Red-hair


Red hair appears amongst Ashkenazi Jews


The Berber and Kabylie populations of northern Algeria and Morocco have occasional redheads.


In Asia, darker or mixed tinges of red hair can be found sporadically from Northern India, Iran and Pakistan, and in rare instances in Japan[10] and the South Pacific. Red hair can be found amongst those of Iranian descent, such as the Pashtuns.

The Indo-Gangetic Plain is a rich, fertile and ancient land encompassing most of northern and eastern India, the most populous parts of Pakistan, and virtually all of Bangladesh. ... The South Pacific is an area in the southern Pacific Ocean. ... The Pashtuns (also Pushtun, Pakhtun, ethnic Afghan, or Pathan) are an ethno-linguistic group consisting mainly of eastern Iranian stock living primarily in eastern and southern Afghanistan, and the North West Frontier Province, Federally Administered Tribal Areas and Baluchistan provinces of Pakistan. ...



A DNA study has concluded that some Neanderthals also had red hair, although the mutation responsible for this differs from that which causes red hair in Homo Sapiens

Red hair can occur with people of different skin color.

That royal mummy has nappy hair



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That's how we be survivin'" - BEP


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Does that mummy look nordish to you?

or that one



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"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP


12:25 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Aug. 2005 | Days Active: 768
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Here are some other "studies" that are believed by "many" and explains the "red hair" people. Enjoy.


DNA EVIDENCE

In, The World's first DNA PCR investigation of Biological Evidence from an Alien Abduction, by Bill Chalker, Anomaly Physical Evidence Group (APEG)
we find that a  Sydney, Australia abduction experience from 1992, with biological evidence, became the subject of the world's first DNA PCR "alien abduction" related investigation, yielding intriguing results that have suggested fascinating new lines of investigation and speculation.. (For the complete story on this please go to
http://www.cufos.org/strange_evidence.pdf)

The original DNA work was done on the shaft of the hair  recovered from an ET  by the abductee. Anomalies were found in the root of the hair. Two types of DNA were found depending on where the mitochondrial DNA testing occurs, namely confirming  a RARE CHINESE TYPE  DNA in the hair shaft and indicating a rare possible BASQUE/GAELIC  type DNA in the root section.

The hair sample seems to show it contains 2 deleted genes for CCR5 protein and no intact gene for normal undeleted CCR5 - this CCR5 deletion factor has been implicated in aids resistance.

The nature of these genetic findings has lead to some interesting possible connections with ancient cultures, myths and archaeological finds such as the strange Taklamakan mummies in China (tall European like peoples with red hair.... some of whom had blonde hair)



BILL CHALKER/APEG Reports the Following:

Many abduction cases exist where alleged biological evidence has been reported. Such events lend themselves to an established forensic DNA profiling technique, which could help establish the credibility of such claims. Since most abduction cases imply a measure of unwanted assault on the victims of such experiences, a forensic approach towards verification of the alleged perpetrators is desirable. Since DNA is the only building block of life that we know, biological specimens recovered in alleged abduction cases would provide researchers with a clear point of comparison.

A key claim by many abduction researchers is that abductions involve some form of genetic agenda. This scenario would require compatibility between aliens and humans. The claims of sexual encounters are alleged to add further support to this scenario. This very element amongst the extraordinary range of fantastic claims made about abductions is one of major stumbling blocks to the credibility of abduction claims.

Mainstream science argues that if alien life exists it is unlikely to be compatible with human life. Hence any claims to the contrary, such as alien abductions, are regarded as absurd. Therefore this limited and focused DNA profiling technique goes to the very heart of one of key claims behind the alleged alien abduction agenda. It provides an opportunity for testing the credibility of such claims.

If such claims are true then there should be some compatibility in the DNA of alleged alien specimens, but some possible anomalies may be evident that would perhaps not be readily reconciled with measures of human DNA variability. One established way of undertaking this is to undertake such analysis with the goal to establish a precise DNA base sequence of mitochondrial hypervariable region I, spanning nucleotides 16,000 to 16,400 of mitochondrial DNA.

Such DNA is present in hundreds of copies within each human cell, and therefore acts as an easily amplified genetic marker for the polymerase chain reaction (PCR), even in moderately degraded samples, i.e. measuring the DNA variability beyond the documented "human consensus" of the region of DNA hypervariability.

This technique has been tested in one abduction case to date, in an investigation undertaken by this writer of a biological sample - a blonde hair - implicated in the abduction milieu of a Sydney man, Peter Khoury, during 1992:

"Strange Evidence", International UFO Reporter (IUR), Spring, 1999 issue, Volume 24, No 1, pgs. 3-16, 31.

"UFO ABDUCTIONS & SCIENCE - A CASE STUDY OF STRANGE EVIDENCE", Australasian Ufologist, Vol.3, No.3, 3rd, 1999, pgs. 43-56.

The original analysis confirmed the hair came from someone who was biologically close to normal human genetics, but of an unusual racial type - a rare Chinese Mongoloid type - one of the rarest human lineages known, that lies further from the human mainstream than any other except for African pygmies and aboriginals.

There was the strange anomaly of it being blonde to clear instead of black, as would be expected from the Asian type mitochondrial DNA. The original DNA work was done on the shaft of the hair. Fascinating further anomalies were found in the root of the hair. Two types of DNA were found depending on where the mitochondrial DNA testing occurs, namely confirming the rare Chinese type DNA in the hair shaft and indicating a rare possible Basque/Gaelic type DNA in the root section.

This case confirms the utility of the DNA forensic approach, however the real challenge ahead for researchers is to determine if these anomalies are both valid and significant. To do this, researchers in the controversial area of abductions should cooperate with a testing programme focused on this specific area of DNA profiling. Testing of a significant number of legitimate samples would provide an opportunity for validation of the unusual anomalies found to date. The further results would add to the database of biological evidence of alleged alien specimens.

Such a strategy could help to determine if aliens are a biological reality and if indeed any are visiting our planet and abducting humans. Perhaps such information could also provide for an interesting perspective on the many stories of Nordic type beings implicated in UFO abduction and contact cases.

The Anomaly Physical Evidence Group (APEG) has been formed to focus attention on biological strategies in abduction investigations. Preliminary funding has facilitated a small laboratory presence addressing this exciting area.



Survivors from both their race and ours eventually met again, beginning with their re-education of our race in the arts of civilization and the ELIMINATION OF HUMAN SACRIFICE.   At least thee or four generations or different races of technoligically advanced people are listed in the CELTIC MYTHOLOGY , with counterparts in other world myths, as well as our own primitive Earthbound race, which they (DANAAN and FOMORIAN) conquered with extreme ease and ruled over in peace for some time before being torn apart themselves by Civil War. At one point, their fear of our potential to rival them caused them to disperse us over the Earth and 'confuse our speech' . Man became embroiled in their conflicts, which appear to have been between two central gods, political parties or races or combination thereof.

A second world conflagration, apparently nucleur, occurred at some later time, (perhaps 4,000 year ago), which may have extended to our Moon and Mars, the latter a base of theirs for at least, the last 450,000 to half a million years if the hisorian Berossus' dating and that of the Cydonia complex are corect. The conflict went into abatement under terms, but never fully concluded.

Though communications between the space races and our own continued, they were severely curtailed and went underground. Man's civilization degenerated, his science becoming all but nonexistent for hundreds of years.  The DANAAN ( a collective convention-name to avoid confusion), always jealous of their technolgoy and secrets, were demonized by the various religions that guarded the traditions established by them long ago, since corrupted by man through ignorance. From active persecution by the Church of contactees between their race and ours in the Dark Ages, man progressed to the point that he dealt with the problem through ridicule or derision by Science instead, in time ascribing the space races to personifications of psychological projections (archetypes), bedtime fables, and santized surrogates such as fairies, the boogeyman and Santa Claus.

The DANAAN themselves are reported to be an aristocratic race of hunters, scientists and poets, preferring their privacy and able to make themselves invisible but keeping touch with the human race. Having fought wars of their own in the pat, they are opposed to them now. Their architecture is a marvel in mathematics and engineering beyond our own capacity to do anything more than appreciate. 'MUSIC' is their principal MAGIC - meaning the controlled use of sound waves HARMONICS to lift and move massive objects possibly up to and including planet sized bodies, though the technology probably has its limits. Their megaliths serve a variety of functions, being used for geodetic markers, recorders of mathematical mesurements, observatories, and in some cases as military strongholds (at least at one time)  Everything about them is simultaneously simply but complex. Their graphics communicate on at least three levels at the same time, being pictorial, mathematical and verbal. The verbal also communicates on at least two levels at one, almost invariably incorporting puns and double entendres.

When they interact with man, it is through their dreams and in riddles, a pattern consistent with Yahweh in the Bible and a variety of  identical gods in all cultures, seeming to prefer inspiring from behind the scenes to any kind of direct communication.  When overt contact is necessary, they assume the guise of the Virgin Mary, the Corn Mother, angels, kachinas, or whatever is appropriate for that culture.  There is a strong circumstantial evidence for this race's continual intervention on a number of levels in man's development from the crudely physical to the artistic, scientific and esoteric.
They cover their tracks with hypnosis and probably drugs or some other high technology, to cloud the memories of their visitants. Their rituals and ways of life derive from a worship of the harmony of nature and the mastery of the mind of man over it.


http://www.burlingtonnews.net/redhairedrace.html


-------
"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP


12:38 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Aug. 2005 | Days Active: 768
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jakelong


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Oh there's also some "conspiracy to hide the truth" there too


Where the Danaan originated from is the question - not   ' do  they exist and that they are here. '  For that , I have already explained and the answer- if you haven't figured it out yet - is 'yes' .  

Evidence appears equally strong for their planet  of origination being inside or outside our solar system, though simple logic would favor the former.  The Danaan could have begun on Mars and moved to Earth in antiquity , the evidence being that the ruins on that planet are a half million years old, or Mars may merely be one of their bases. Possible pole shifts on Earth further confuse the question of whether this race may have started on Mars or Venus. The demolished remains that comprise the asteroid belt between Mars  and Jupiter, mythically referred to as Tiamat, are another credible possibility.
Given our limited understanding of the planets, it is also possible that they came from an outer body in our system. An Upper, Lower, and Middle World being common to most mythologies, available myths can be read as indiating that a white race originally came to the Middle World of Earth from the Upper World of Venus , and established antoher colony of their own on (or in)  the Lower Worlds of Mars, all of which have served as homes at various times.  It is possible that they came from Sirius,l Orion or the Pleiades, but the evidence of their use of three stage rockets in ancient Egypt would seem to indicate their technology at that time insufficient to navigate farther than the closest planets.  The ancient race could have originated within our system and later developed sufficient technology to conquer the stars , or come from beyond and suffered dire setback due to unforeseen catastrophe, having to rediscover  their technology afterwards.  Indeed , given the various American Indian legends of the gods weeping for their 'sunken Red Land' the multiple references to space as a vast ocean and numerous occult connections, it is likely that Mars was the original 'island' of Atlantis that 'sank beneath the waves' , with the name LATER apply to any similar global catastrophe which followed on our own planet.

We know just as little about where this race is presently based. Mars, as well as the moon, seem to be active bases.  Evidence strongly indicates that they may be living beneath the surface of Mars and probably have for a long time.

It is time for all truths to be revealed. Fear is born out of ignorance and knowledge dispels fear. Questions have been sufficiently studied to make its conclusions known. First CIA DIRECTION REAR ADMIRAL HILLENKOETTER, who was in on the entire study from the very beginning, stated in his opinion in 1960 that ': THE PUBLIC HAS A RIGHT TO KNOW. It  is time for the truth to be brought out in open Congressional hearings...through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe the unknown flying objects are nonsense."  If there was once reason to withold information regarding ufos from the public, it has since operated to our own detriment to continue doing so. The vacuum of ignorance has led people to speculate on the ugliest possible conspiracy scenerios, or to find dangerous if not actively hostile alien beings behind the phenomenon where none exist.

"IT IS SELF EVIDENT THAT THE PUBLIC BE TOLD THE TRUTH", CARL JUNG WROTE TO DONALD KEYHOLD., "because ultimately it will nevertheless come to light. There can hardly be any greater shock than the H-bomb and yet everybody knows of it without faiting."


http://www.burlingtonnews.net/redhairedrace.html

The internet is so lulz

-------
"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP


12:40 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Aug. 2005 | Days Active: 768
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( kidd rune )


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Thats why race is basically something you can't prove and define 100%.
Actually, race has been proven MANY times.

Here are some stupid comments by anti-race people:
http://raceandreason.110mb.com/files/~Race and its Existence/Seven Dumb Ideas about Race.html

And here is an explanation why race DOES exist:
http://www.racialcompact.com/Race_ Realityand Denial.html


yes it is. (look out the failtroll is going to say "no it is isn't" then I can say again "yes it is". Thats pretty funny stuff.
It IS relevant. Negroes can't really create a society whether or not it's their genetic makeup, which is the only reason that seems possible. All these other reasons you claim can exist have been nonexistent beforehand, yet the Negro hasn't done anything about it.



Nubia was not a shit-hole

http://wysinger.homestead.com/chronology.html


We're talking about South Africa, not Nubia.

The Nubians took over Egypt by massive numbers, directly contributing to its downfall.  


Red hair can occur with people of different skin color.
With Nordish ancestry.
Your site claims these people can have red hair:
Ashkenazi Jews - Came from the Rhineland, I'd expect many of them to have Nordish ancestors. They're from Germany, where Nordish blood isn't rare at all.
Algeria and Morocco - North Africa has many whites.
Asia - There were many Nordish invasions into Asia.
Northern India - India was invaded by Indo-Aryans a long time ago. Many, no doubt, had red hair.
Iran - The name "Iran" came directly FROM Aryan.
Pakistan - Indo-Aryan invasion.
South Pacific - Did you forget that the British dumped people over there? I'm sure you know Celts have red hair more commonly than anyone else.
Neanderthals - irrelevant because they're not humans



Red hair can occur with people of different skin color.
You can be part-nordish with many skin colors too. Are you STILL insisting that race is skin-deep?


mummy pictures

And? I NEVER said that only whites existed in Egypt. There are a LOT of nonwhite mummies.

Post edited at 1:16 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 by kidd rune

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"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"


1:15 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Nov. 2007 | Days Active: 269
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jakelong


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Quote: from kidd rune at 1:15 pm on Sep. 7, 2008

It IS relevant.
No it isn't.

Man this is so fun.


We're talking about South Africa, not Nubia.
why not? If we talk about Egypt it makes MORE sense to talk about Nubia. And shakenbake was talking about nubia.


Ashkenazi Jews - Came from the Rhineland, I'd expect many of them to have Nordish ancestors. They're from Germany, where Nordish blood isn't rare at all.
I thought they were slavs from khazaria accroding to some other "study" supported by "many".

But good that means they are FROM THE SAME STOCK AS germans and nordic ppl?



Algeria and Morocco - North Africa has many whites.
Asia - There were many Nordish invasions into Asia.
Northern India - India was invaded by Indo-Aryans a long time ago. Many, no doubt, had red hair.
Iran - The name "Iran" came directly FROM Aryan.
Pakistan - Indo-Aryan invasion.
South Pacific - Did you forget that the British dumped people over there? I'm sure you know Celts have red hair more commonly than anyone else.

Meh those nordish ppl were prolly just Dannans.

 


And? I NEVER said that only whites existed in Egypt. There are a LOT of nonwhite mummies.
Of Royal ancestry.

-------
"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP

1:22 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Aug. 2005 | Days Active: 768
Join to learn more about jakelong California, United States | Straight Male | Posts: 14,313 | Points: 25,206
( kidd rune )


Enlightened One

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No it isn't.

Man this is so fun.


Yes it is :)


why not? If we talk about Egypt it makes MORE sense to talk about Nubia. And shakenbake was talking about nubia.
You don't make a point about South Africa with Nubia.

Now, what do you have to say about the crisis in South Africa?


I thought they were slavs from khazaria accroding to some other "study" supported by "many".
Link


But good that means they are FROM THE SAME STOCK AS germans and nordic ppl?
No. They are Armenids, but, being in Europe, there is a good chance they have some nordish ancestors.

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

1:39 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Nov. 2007 | Days Active: 269
Join to learn more about kidd rune Florida, United States | Straight Male | Posts: 10,504 | Points: 14,195
( kidd rune )


Enlightened One

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Meh those nordish ppl were prolly just Dannans.
What?


Of Royal ancestry.
Yes. Pharaohs, scribes, the like. It would help to give me names and dates though.

-------
"One of the Germans... would frequently snatch a child from the
woman's arms and... tear the child in half... Such incidents...
occurred all the time." - A Year in Treblinka, Yankel Wiernik,
Treblinka's "most authoritative eyewitness"

1:41 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Nov. 2007 | Days Active: 269
Join to learn more about kidd rune Florida, United States | Straight Male | Posts: 10,504 | Points: 14,195
jakelong


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Quote: from kidd rune at 1:39 pm on Sep. 7, 2008


But good that means they are FROM THE SAME STOCK AS germans and nordic ppl?
No. They are Armenids

You just said they were nordish.



but, being in Europe, there is a good chance they have some nordish ancestors.
Well looks like ALL our ancestors are prolly nordish, So  making differences within races makes no sense.

Within EVERY race theres a bunch a of ppl who are nordish. sometimes they are majority sometimes there are minority. all it proves then is that we are ALL related.

QED

-------
"Everyone helpin' each other whenever they can we makin' it happen, from nothin' to somethin'
That's how we be survivin'" - BEP


2:02 pm on Sep. 7, 2008 | Joined: Aug. 2005 | Days Active: 768
Join to learn more about jakelong California, United States | Straight Male | Posts: 14,313 | Points: 25,206
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